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So, what are you guys hoping for in S24?


Mike A

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3 hours ago, srek said:

To the best of my knowledge one big reason to not show the upgrade price is that there are quite a few different variations out there where people do own other MAXON products or want upgrades for other than the last version. It is actually easier to clear this up on a per case base than trying to offer all options on a page.

Well...prior to the subscription roll out you were able to show that perpetual upgrade information for multiple versions of C4D (Prime, Broadcast, Studio, etc).  So why is it now so difficult? 

 

You did mention an impact if people own multiple MAXON products.  Does that imply, as a Redshift owner, that my upgrade pricing for C4D and Redshift will be a bundled price that is lower than if I upgraded each separately?

 

Just looking for clarity as what was once readily available information is now hidden (from a user perspective) and such invites suspicion.

 

Dave

Sorry...but I simply do not have enough faith to be an atheist.

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3 hours ago, clarence said:

The complaints in this thread are very similar to almost every Lightwave and Modo release thread I’ve read over the past 15 years - regardless of the actual quality of the release. And from what I’ve heard, it’s the same for 3d Studio. 

 

It seems 3d professionals are really hard to please. 

People really need to watch Chris Schmidt's EXCELLENT overview of S24 at RocketLasso before they pass any sort of judgement.  He takes almost 90 minutes to explain everything and is very thorough.  From the standpoint that this is a 0.5 release (IMHO as it was only six months since the last release), I find it a very respectable set of features. 

 

Look....everything in this release is focused on USER EFFICIENCY which is never a bad thing and something which you will only appreciate after you used it for a bit and then try to go back to the old way of doing things.  I can see that happening with the Asset browser, place tools and the tween tools where you say "how did I live without this for so long?".   The tween tool alone should make life easier for animators everywhere.  

 

True - nothing big - nothing flashy - nothing to make the competition stand up and take notice.....but all very useful nonetheless.

 

Dave

Sorry...but I simply do not have enough faith to be an atheist.

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I have a question regarding bug fixes on each release of C4D to the developers:

There was a quite repetitive bug that happened in the timeline, when copying keyframes from one object to another (specially when working with characters, needing to copy a walk cycle from left feet to right feet for example...) that would work in a very inconsistent manner. 
I've submitted a ticket a few months ago about this, and pointed at this forum for the issue.

I've experimented very quickly with S24 last night, and noticed that this bug is now fixed. 
But, what about version R23? Will it get the same fix? There hasnt been updates on version R23 for quite some time now (I check every week for it)

And lets suppose, if I had decided to buy the perpetual license R23 on september last year. 
This version, should still be suported for bug fixes no? 

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6 minutes ago, FLima said:

I have a question regarding bug fixes on each release of C4D to the developers:

There was a quite repetitive bug that happened in the timeline, when copying keyframes from one object to another (specially when working with characters, needing to copy a walk cycle from left feet to right feet for example...) that would work in a very inconsistent manner. 
I've submitted a ticket a few months ago about this, and pointed at this forum for the issue.

I've experimented very quickly with S24 last night, and noticed that this bug is now fixed. 
But, what about version R23? Will it get the same fix? There hasnt been updates on version R23 for quite some time now (I check every week for it)

And lets suppose, if I had decided to buy the perpetual license R23 on september last year. 
This version, should still be suported for bug fixes no? 

That question should go to management or QA, not devs. Devs only fixes what they are told to fix and nothing more. What they can do is say that its to risky to fix depending on the cycle timeframe but again, severity of the issue also plays part into that. So some issues might not be fixed do to sever risk of braking something else which would cause even more issues.

 

Unfortunately, no you will not see those fixes inside R23 at any point, R23 was closed book after first Service Pack, so if you want to see fixes, you need to upgrade to S24. 

 

If you would buy perpetual of R23, you only get SP and nothing more. Whats there its there!

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"Devs only fixes what they are told to fix and nothing more."

 

This sounds very much like resistance from developers to fix anything and they need to be "told" to do so. That is not true. It is always a question of priorities and these are created by evaluating many factors and inputs.

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30 minutes ago, 3D-Pangel said:

People really need to watch Chris Schmidt's EXCELLENT overview of S24 at RocketLasso before they pass any sort of judgement.  He takes almost 90 minutes to explain everything and is very thorough.  From the standpoint that this is a 0.5 release (IMHO as it was only six months since the last release), I find it a very respectable set of features. 

 

Look....everything in this release is focused on USER EFFICIENCY which is never a bad thing and something which you will only appreciate after you used it for a bit and then try to go back to the old way of doing things.  I can see that happening with the Asset browser, place tools and the tween tools where you say "how did I live without this for so long?".   The tween tool alone should make life easier for animators everywhere.  

 

True - nothing big - nothing flashy - nothing to make the competition stand up and take notice.....but all very useful nonetheless.

 

Dave

You are right. If Chriss Schmidt's presentation had been the official MAXON presentation I could imagine that there would have been less complaints. Therefor it also might be a communications problem.

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2 minutes ago, Fritz said:

"Devs only fixes what they are told to fix and nothing more."

 

This sounds very much like resistance from developers to fix anything and they need to be "told" to do so. That is not true. It is always a question of priorities and these are created by evaluating many factors and inputs.

Tell me how many times you fixed something if QA or Management didn't tell you? And no that doesn't sound like that at all, at least that was not the point and I also mentioned priorities. 😉 

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3 minutes ago, Igor said:

That question should go to management or QA, not devs. Devs only fixes what they are told to fix and nothing more. What they can do is say that its to risky to fix depending on the cycle timeframe but again, severity of the issue also plays part into that. So some issues might not be fixed do to sever risk of braking something else which would cause even more issues.

 

Unfortunately, no you will not see those fixes inside R23 at any point, R23 was closed book after first Service Pack, so if you want to see fixes, you need to upgrade to S24. 

 

If you would buy perpetual of R23, you only get SP and nothing more. Whats there its there!


So, if someone decides to invest a large sum of money into the software, they basically have no more support on faulty aspects of this software, less than 6 months after its release? 
This doesnt feel right at all. When you buy something, this something needs to work as it is intended, full stop. 
This is the way it was before the subscription model was adopted. My perpetual license of R18 got updates even 1 year afterwards with essential fixes. 

I understand obviously that new features are added within each release, and sometimes a new feature could already contain a fix for an old problem. 
But if that is the case, this needs to be more transparent than the way it is now. 

Locking out a fix to a problem that was in the software to only users who are willing to update and pay for the subscription it is not a way to treat people who invest in the software in the first place. It shouldnt even be legal. 

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1 minute ago, FLima said:

 


So, if someone decides to invest a large sum of money into the software, they basically have no more support on faulty aspects of this software, less than 6 months after its release? 
This doesnt feel right at all. When you buy something, this something needs to work as it is intended, full stop. 
This is the way it was before the subscription model was adopted. My perpetual license of R18 got updates even 1 year afterwards with essential fixes. 

I understand obviously that new features are added within each release, and sometimes a new feature could already contain a fix for an old problem. 
But if that is the case, this needs to be more transparent than the way it is now. 

Locking out a fix to a problem that was in the software to only users who are willing to update and pay for the subscription it is not a way to treat people who invest in the software in the first place. It shouldnt even be legal. 

Well as far as I know, this goes for all Subscription models out there, but I might be wrong. 

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43 minutes ago, Igor said:

Well as far as I know, this goes for all Subscription models out there, but I might be wrong. 

I really hope someone from MAXON can clarify this... because I honestly almost considered, thanks to a project last year, purchasing the perpetual license R23. 

Aside from all my previous coments regarding the updaes on this release S24, because I can see a lot of people enjoyed it (maybe I was not the target audience for it, and that is fine) 
But bug fixes for me, is a big deal.
This copy/paste bug from timeline specifically, directly affected my production last year, specially working on 2-3 characters simultaneously.

I really hope this is not the case...

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We always endeavor to deliver the software in the most stable and bug-free state possible, and typically ship a service pack with additional bugfixes shortly after each release.

 

It's simply impractical to backport every bugfix to earlier releases. Many times a bugfix relies on new core enhancements, and even when they don't the codebase has changed sufficiently that merging the fix is not easy and is very likely to have unintended consequences.

 

This is fundamentally the benefit of subscription - you always ensure that you have access to the latest and greatest MAXON has to offer, the shiny features, the workflow enhancements and the quality improvements. MAXON is continuing to balance those benefits as best we can versus customer requests for a continued perpetual offer.

 

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