luchifer

23 hours ago, Igor said:

 If you don't like moves I make in coming days, and you decide to depart from us, I wish you all the best wherever you find your people. 

Thanks for all the fish.

Im really thinking about paying to support the forum while listening to Blender preachers all the time, and frankly I dont want to.

2 hours ago, Icecaveman said:

Observations from a former Making-it-Look-Great c4d user.

 

 

Companies copy from each other. We build on each other's ideas. Good artists steal. I get it. But again, I don't want to curate the best of Blender to help make that easier.

 

I won't belabor the point.

 

Recently I've come to stop trying to convert any c4d users to Blender. The efforts to persuade don't work and just create bad will. And I'm trying to operate with a spirit of détente. But I admit I'm an emotional guy; I will have my lapses. Certain things really pissss me off.

So... he thinks Blender invented Circularize, Bridge etc and C4D copied it? Holger Biebrach claimed that first...  whats next? people complaining about Maya MASH looking at the mirror at Mograph tools? Blender sculpt tools that looks so similar to Zbrush?

You cant complain all the time about C4D not having the same tools as beloved Blender, and then complain when C4D have the same tools as beloved Blender /facepalm

congratz!

I also want to add -and this is important for new users- while its true Blender has amazing modeling boolean plugins, please dont forget to learn proper modeling workflows and UV layout, because, as much fun as its to work with Booleans, they are great for showcase / concept but tend to produce horrible geometry, unusable to deform or subdivide. There are a few guys over Blender who care about topology, one is this guy who sells a tutorial for 60 dollars, link in the video description, and  the other one is Meshmachine.

Adding Blender to your modeling arsenal will help C4D guys because frankly, modeling in Blender is a lot of fun -only second to Maya in my humble opinion- and if you already have xparticles in your arsenal, its a powerful combo. Maxon is making a lot of progress on its modeling tools, but its still cumbersome to model in C4D, for example in C4D as soon as you drop a tool you lose your selection, if im doing a loop cut followed by a bevel, I have to cut, and then reselect the edge loop I just cut it and was already highlighted (!!!!), only then I can bevel it or move it or whatever, its annoying and time consuming.

https://blendermarket.com/products/meshmachine

My two grains of salt... ignore the users who teach you to move by pressing G+X / G+Y or G+Z, Its impractical to rembember your up axis all the time when you are modeling. Just go to any orthographic window and use G + drag the middle mouse button (or the pen) in the direction you intend your object / element to go to. This applies as well to scale and rotation (S+ middle mouse button and drag). Ctrl while doing that will snap position / rotation in increment. S+ MMdrag + Numpad Zero will collapse your selection in case you are wondering. R+ MM drag + Numpad will set your rotation angle towards a desired number.

Rotation is better on an ortographic window though (Alt + drag middle mouse button will switch your view from perspective to ortographic just like Zbrush does.

1 hour ago, Igor said:

So due to all suggestions and feedback, I now have implemented few new things  we can use to try and minimize negativity around topics.

From today we are going to be able to set Dislike and Troll votes. On top of that, Moderators now have ability to warn you through integrated Warning system where depending on the amount of points, you either get restriction to post for few hours, or get banned for few days. This is all connected and Ill update you in a separate post which will end under guidelines, but for now, just letting everyone know new systems are in place...ah and yes, there is also Ignore feature now too. So when you ignore someone (Hover over their name), you don't get to read their posts anymore.

Thank you for making this place a healthy forum Igor!!! Can I just add a suggestion? To implement that Admins and Moderators cant be ignored, so trolls cant say "Is not fair, no one gave me a warning!"

15 minutes ago, Icecaveman said:

 

Curious if you could share your thinking on this. Why so?

 

In my opinion if a user doesn't care to hear, for example, about my excitement for Blender, they should have the option to mute my posts. I use the "ignore" feature frequently on a football forum I visit. But maybe I'm missing something, so curious about your view.

If I may, an ignore option like Twitter has when you cant see post from a certain user only harm the community. You can be a Blender troll but at the same time can be incredibly helpful towards C4D users, so people will want to hear your posts -just not all of them.

A hidden post flagged by the community should be better, but this community doesnt have a lot of actige participants so the threshold to flag a post would be really low.

At this point I really believe what works best is to babysit problematic users and ban them from the forums for a certain period of time so they can recapacite.

I dont know guys, given that we are circling back to the same arguments, I still cant believe you guys let twelve pages of an argument who pretty much started with "Maxon is BLM, LGBTi an Ukraine friendly, so im going over Blender but this is not political post", and just because it trash talked C4D, people who hate Maxon didnt even bothered with said argument even if the wording couldnt be more clear.

This is exactly why people like me only show up every couple of months, to see if community has improved. Sadly is not the case and I have no doubts someone will still call Cerbera "power hungry".

My only complain about the moderators is that I expected at least a warning for the concealed racist tone somewhere along the first twelve pages.

1 hour ago, Marcio G. said:

Your job as a moderator is to limit personal attacks, flamewars, racist stuff, spam, unsolicited ads, piracy links, etc..

Interesting point of view... you do realize the thread you want to stay open started with "Like every other corporation Maxon will support NFT, BLM, LGBT"

Please Cerbera, next time, kindly do your job and lock those threads earlier.

50 minutes ago, Marcio G. said:

 

Moderation would have been a warning post like "Guys, please tone down or I will lock this post" not instant lock because you didn't like the direction of the conversation. This is one of the few CG forums left. Please don't kill it with heavy-handed moderation like what happened with CGTalk.

What??? CGTalk died because of lack of moderation.

There were countless of threads about random advertising stuff that no one deleted -even porn sites that have little to none connection to CG work- also there was a lot of personal attacks against mods like Leigh Van Der Byl suffered for no reason at all. People just had enough and leave, and because trolls realized there wasnt anyone else to pester anymore, they left too.

3 hours ago, Lonchaney said:

Apparently that was not the only thing they copied...

 

 

I have seen this and it doesnt make sense, HB tools were great but none of them were innovative, they were adapted existing tools that filled the gap between C4D and other DCC who already have Circularize or such. And you cant blame C4D for closing the gap, or not talking about development (most companies have very strict NDA policies)

19 hours ago, hvanderwegen said:

 

Well, the old Physical is part of a group of legacy ray tracers that produce a certain look quite fast.

 

C4d users are not the only ones finding themselves in a state of render engine transition

 

 

Great post, I just want to add Mental Ray for Maya was discarded for Arnold, and while people at first complained about it -old project no longer worked, unlike C4D where you can still open old projects besides Prorender- eventrually, time proved that it was the right move to do.

On 5/3/2022 at 8:31 PM, Shrike said:

 

 Opening a new file means opening an entire new Blender application

 

 

I guess you are opening a pre 2.8 scene into 2.8+ ? just untick load UI on open file > cogwheel preferences

To the OP.... you want to leave C4D because of its political stance with BLM / UKR... and you chose Blender because?

https://www.blender.org/press/the-war-in-ukraine/

My two cents about software development from the perspective of a user: If its so easy to create a DCC as simple to use as C4D and pleasant to work with, why dont more companies do the same?

Autodesk has tried literally everything from spacebar menus to ribbons, tabs, gradients as sliders, there is no continuity between its own tools (mash has its own interface, bifrost has its own interface) and now the Viewcube is making a comeback even if some users hated it. Blender interface pre 2.8 was weird to put it politedly, Houdini is ... Houdini I guess? 

Maxon has proven they have a rock solid interface even if the last make over wasnt very well received by some users and xpresso not getting a makeover,  so they also use development time to make things look and work within the same philosophy among tools instead of "lets just code it and then we figure out the interface"

edit.. Im not want to start a comparison dicussion between apps, its just a personal point of view about the interface. Im sure there are users who loved to interact with Prisms.

12 minutes ago, Icecaveman said:

Maxon is adding unneeded features to its software  that will perpetually add complexity, thus slowing code development and escalating instability for users.

You can always collapse the stack into a new object.

People often find the way to use tools outside the boundaries of what are they intended to. Thats the reason a lot of artists just love to use C4D, even if pushing boundaries tend to slow to a crawl the interface. A font wont have complexity but it sure helps to remesh it to keep working on it, and if you need to change the text, or the font itself for whatever reason, you can do it with the new remesh and you wont lose almost any time. So, while useless for a motion picture, its perfect for broadcast.

8 hours ago, Icecaveman said:

 

This is an example of what I talked about earlier: hype and salesmanship. In my opinion.

 

Has anyone ever seriously complained that QuadRemesher wasn't parametric? No!

 

Remeshing is an operation that takes 2-20 seconds...and typically gets run a few times per day, if that. Why do I care to work while it's operating? I most emphatically wouldn't(!) want to work while its operating as the outcome of its processing will dictate what I do next.

 

As for it being parametric: Yawn. QR saves the original object(s) and just turns off its visibility. I would seriously not want to have a remesher as part of a stack, especially where high-CPU volume processing is layered in that stack, or I'm going to deform it, animate it, apply physics to it! I prefer stability and speed and including something like that in a live processing enviro would be a complete no-go for me. That's the kind of thinking that is making c4d ever more crash-prone.

 

 

You are right, im sorry I should have put the -wich was the main complain- between the part where we can guide the remesh with density maps, hard edges or flow splines  (wich get us closer to zremesher flow control with painting) that wasnt available to Quadremesher, but as I was typing the sentence I was just thinking about how smooth was working with c4d remesh instead of zbrush (I use it a lot for hardsurface, and often you have to leave the pc like half and hour to complete remeshing all the subtools and then I have to examine one by one and correct them).

Not sure what they added but in Zbrush I cant remesh and keep working at the same time, but In C4D land I can.

So, to sum it up, its Quadremesher 2.0 + full integration with C4D, plus Maxon One users can jump back and forth to zbrush if they want to remesh over there.

Main difference Quadremesher wasnt parametric -that was the main complain- this one lets you keep your history stack, also it can receive some additional guidelines that I believe wasnt available with exoside. It also lets you work while is doing the remesh. And if you have Maxon One you already have Quadremesher as in Zbrush remesh anyway.

Like every major DCC, C4D is a very complete package with plugins, so... improvements most likely will have an addon counterpart (we still dont have fluids, particles and we got this with plugins like xparticles or realflow).

2 hours ago, johanal said:

 

 

Sorry but big companies like Maxon and Autodesk always create "first iteration" features which will take YEARS to mature  however, within 1-2 years they are left to languish in dev hell.    

Thats progress, or evolution, I dont know how to call it, but as technology advances this will happen. I see you use Blender -as I do too- rememeber Blender Internal? gone Blender Game Engine? gone as well.

Autodesk as far as I can remember discarded Autodesk Composite (that was its name?), Mash is incomplete, so there goes the alternative to MoGraph.

Like others mentioned, Maxon dropped the ball with Bodypaint and xpresso. XSI did the same with particles, and by the time ICE was ready, it was too late for Softimage.

Maxon new core and new and improved tools means you either rise like a Phoenix or burn like Icarus.

51 minutes ago, Marcio G. said:

Maya and 3ds Max indie cost a fraction of what Cinema 4D costs and they are both much more complete 3D packages (you'd need a Maxon One susbscription to get closer to what Maya alone offers). 

 

Thats true for indies -bear in mind companies cant have multiple indie licenses- as of now, with Maxon One you also get Redshift GPU + Zbrush + some AE plugins and thats 200 dollar less than Autodesk Maya.

1 hour ago, BoganTW said:

But I rarely hear many people saying, wow, the experience of using Blender is much smoother and easier than using C4D. It's always a list of the features, bragging about how it's free, and a thread dump of all the new companies that have come on board to sponsor it, so the future is getting brighter and brighter, why would anyone want to use anything else, etc 

Modeling is really great, but C4D just made some welcome improvements in 26. EEVEE is great, everything else is meh.

58 minutes ago, destta said:

 

Can u guys make something production ready like a pillow laying on a couch? 5 min task in Marvellous. But u will waste HOURS and still get nothing.

 

 

When i say "Cinema 4D has the worst cloth simulation on the market" - this is informed opinion, you know. Default settings on video.

 

I dont know If you are doing something wrong, but with default settings my plane doesnt go through the floor. I didnt do a pillow because I have things to do and only wanted to test if the objects went through the floor. I only changed thickness because no one should be using default settings anyway.

Also... 5 minutes / default settings and production ready doesnt mix well in the same sentence.

If you can do something faster or better in Marvelous, Zbrush or Houdini by all means do it. This is not a contest of speed as far as I know. In production, you use the tool that works for what you are doing, thats it.

7 minutes ago, Marcio G. said:

About students and GPUs: In my experience teaching 3D in a university in the US, most of my students have gaming laptops with a RTX or GTX Nvidia cards. The only ones who don't are the Apple fanboys, but they usually learn fast that Macbooks are not good for 3D and get a gaming laptop with a Nvidia GPU in the next semester. 

With the current prices of GPU around the Globe, CPUs are more atractive every day.

9 minutes ago, Marcio G. said:

Maya, 3ds max and Blender come with out of the box high quality GPU renderers

Maya and 3dsmax and also Cinema4d have GPU render with a subscription plan.

If you find a perpetual Maya license, please let me know.

My take on the CPU / GPU debate, as an Arnold user, I have a dual xeon with a quadro m4000 at work with Arnold and perpetual c4d, and i7 with a gtx 1080 with maxon one and RS at home. Some projects, Arnold CPU is as fast as Redshift GPU and some projects is slower.

If we upgrade, this would mean, I could use the RS at work, with a dual xeon, and hopefully if RS developers can catch up with Arnold CPU, we can eventually migrate to full RS GPU.

1 hour ago, DaveW said:

Can you create UDIMs in the UV editor inside C4D? 

Yes you just need to move them by one unit with transform tools on UV tools, let me check later if I have an example but im sure it can be done. I used the udim workflow with the mech a year ago (modeled was done with zbrush / boxcutter)